We Got Ed
Nor Man Gold Man
Rachell Mad*dow
Keith Olbermann
Thom Hartmann
Ron Reagan
Not the least of the lesser lights,**
but in particular order,
Pardon me not the least, Chris Matthews.
Links to be added later, might be. Or maybe.
[Locker Room Snap, Within Limits, Rather Miffication, or Retrogressing in reserve.]
** 12-31-09 upper links and asterisk added: an awkward way of saying I was probably forgetting some
* 1-2-10 slipped in 2nd link and worse (excuse the asteriskal anachronism: not/anachronistic )
FORMER HOME OF BEATINGAROUNDTHEBUSH.ORG >> HOME OF Political_Progress_For_People.blogspot.com >> >> >> Political Prodding and Probing People for Progress << << << >>> [[ For those NOT...BeatingAroundTheBush See links.]] <<< [[ EMAIL: LeRoy-Rogers at comcast net ]]
Wednesday, December 30, 2009
Thursday, December 24, 2009
Happy Holidays
Merry Christmas to the Democrats
and Happy Boxing Day to the Republicans,
not to be PC or leave any others out.
Or other coping havens of hope.
[President Obama Hails Reform/Salon]
[Here they are! The Bills side by side. Detroit Free Press]
[Note that the above two links were read and inserted after the rest of this post, except ** and ***, not to mention David Sirota ]
My comment:
[In a bit of Re-Mythication, I might say: From hurding cats to a real cat fight, this is no sausage or hot diggity dog eat dog world. Or from Real Mythication to Real Miffication in regards to others, it is better than FAUX News.]
[** semantics are more than a quibble between liberals and progressives, but between principles and progress (side note: some claim that "progressive" is just a label to avoid the "liberal" charge but both are needed, while labels should not give cover for inaction or misconceptions.]
[***(late insert) also: or just say now]
RETRO NOTE: The Ed Show. Not to mention Miff Maddow.
[1-7-09 Hit Ping Pong (see Shhhh!) on the table.]
and Happy Boxing Day to the Republicans,
not to be PC or leave any others out.
Or other coping havens of hope.
[President Obama Hails Reform/Salon]
[Here they are! The Bills side by side. Detroit Free Press]
[Note that the above two links were read and inserted after the rest of this post, except ** and ***, not to mention David Sirota ]
My comment:
It would seem to me that Congress should be able to "get 'er done" without the 60 votes. Either as some suggest by "going nuclear" (I am against Nuclear Power but) by blowing up the filibuster or somehow utilizing a reconciliation or conference process to do it. Failing that, there are probably enough progressives to kill the bill, but that may not be necessary[or advised**]. Removing the mandate, just might put this in the category of a budget issue under reconciliation, but failing to remove the mandate, might just put this on the track for constitutional review and modification, where it is imagined that a public option just might be the only option. It just might be wise for the Republicans not to push the constitutional issue and settle for a public option now, possibly with a 10-15% buyin margin on Medicare. In the alternative, giving states an option to have a public* plan, and freeing those to sell out of state, might be another crack in the (just say no)[***] armor.
[TruthOut/McClatchy -- Steve Clemons/Huffington}
* one Representative mentioned that the option would have a name other than public, and that could just be non-profit or within the caps imposed.
[In a bit of Re-Mythication, I might say: From hurding cats to a real cat fight, this is no sausage or hot diggity dog eat dog world. Or from Real Mythication to Real Miffication in regards to others, it is better than FAUX News.]
[** semantics are more than a quibble between liberals and progressives, but between principles and progress (side note: some claim that "progressive" is just a label to avoid the "liberal" charge but both are needed, while labels should not give cover for inaction or misconceptions.]
[***(late insert) also: or just say now]
RETRO NOTE: The Ed Show. Not to mention Miff Maddow.
[1-7-09 Hit Ping Pong (see Shhhh!) on the table.]
Monday, December 21, 2009
Buy In?
[[UPDATE 12-23-09:
Salon v. Huffington*
Throwing in the towel of bipartisanship and/or getting it together?
Who needs Republicans when the Democrats have two wings?
(On the other hand: High Stakes Poker [**] anyone?)
* Wonk Room actually, but the sentiment counts and change happens. ]]
[**Thanks to Thom Hartmann ]
[Resume original post]
The Senate Hurdle? The Federal Option.
[OurFuture.org]
Optimistic Sense?
Real Mythication
UPDATES
Saving the spot *
Get 'er done
Hiatus of Thought
Rubric's Cube...
[12-22-09: Think Progress Hopenhagen, (FT, WaPo, NYTimes) OurFuture.org Bumbling Economy?]
Salon v. Huffington*
Throwing in the towel of bipartisanship and/or getting it together?
Who needs Republicans when the Democrats have two wings?
(On the other hand: High Stakes Poker [**] anyone?)
* Wonk Room actually, but the sentiment counts and change happens. ]]
[**Thanks to Thom Hartmann ]
[Resume original post]
The Senate Hurdle? The Federal Option.
[OurFuture.org]
Optimistic Sense?
Real Mythication
UPDATES
Saving the spot *
Get 'er done
Hiatus of Thought
Rubric's Cube...
[12-22-09: Think Progress Hopenhagen, (FT, WaPo, NYTimes) OurFuture.org Bumbling Economy?]
Wednesday, December 16, 2009
A Fifth
Sense.
Four,
Three,
Two,
One,
Blast !
...Off* from the Base
and Rocking the Table **.
[*] 12-17-09 Dean on Hardball
[**] 12-17-09 AKA(no such thing as bad press ***) It bleeds we lead an unwinding of irony. i.e. Keep Up the Pres$ure for Progress. The president's low polling should acknowledge more that the left is not approving, than independents or his base being lost, or that there are more that think Republican's or Tea Partiers have the solutions. While Dean's pressure cannot be acknowledged or minimized without losing the animus for progress. He said kill the Senate Bill, not the process or reform.
*** Thank you Senators Cantwell and McCain!!?!!
[12-19-09 Sometimes Polls Matter.
Four,
Three,
Two,
One,
Blast !
...Off* from the Base
and Rocking the Table **.
[*] 12-17-09 Dean on Hardball
[**] 12-17-09 AKA(no such thing as bad press ***) It bleeds we lead an unwinding of irony. i.e. Keep Up the Pres$ure for Progress. The president's low polling should acknowledge more that the left is not approving, than independents or his base being lost, or that there are more that think Republican's or Tea Partiers have the solutions. While Dean's pressure cannot be acknowledged or minimized without losing the animus for progress. He said kill the Senate Bill, not the process or reform.
*** Thank you Senators Cantwell and McCain!!?!!
[12-19-09 Sometimes Polls Matter.
Real Mythication
Senator Franken on Republican entitlement.
Nicole Sanders on Lieberman Bill
Charge of the Dense Brigade
Speaking of Tools...
Seeking shelter, does not a tool make.*
I mean, why not credit it with conservationist or materialist ideology?(the octopus)(recycled or supply side economics)
(UP - date)
(Get err done, or is it ARRR?)
(Pulled from draft:
A portion of making a point? as inspired sources...
John Podesta
Doctrine airy
Hopenhagen?
What a drag.)**
REAL MYTHICATION (title finally added above).
Hmmm.
** or scroll over links
[Nightmare before Mainstreet?]
Nicole Sanders on Lieberman Bill
Charge of the Dense Brigade
Speaking of Tools...
Seeking shelter, does not a tool make.*
I mean, why not credit it with conservationist or materialist ideology?(the octopus)(recycled or supply side economics)
(UP - date)
(Get err done, or is it ARRR?)
(Pulled from draft:
A portion of making a point? as inspired sources...
John Podesta
Doctrine airy
Hopenhagen?
What a drag.)**
REAL MYTHICATION (title finally added above).
Hmmm.
The Real Rubric's Cube? Or from the mouth of Rubes or other caricatures?*sequentially eventually I beg to differ: a punderstanding of evolution
** or scroll over links
[Nightmare before Mainstreet?]
Tuesday, December 15, 2009
UPDATES
First Comment Added.(1)12-15-09
UPDATE(2) Con Text ADDED 12-15-09
Needs attention(4):go figure
Note Several items saved in draft
(there should be only one with this label)*
[blank, making the point?, updates]
Recent Index beyond (1-4)**
Hiatus of Thought (3)
[Under Construction]
12-16-09
* note asterisk moved from previous line and irony of example as saved in draft are not accessible but following line notes 3 of several (punderstanding of grammar and puctuation)
** index aka archive you search
Real Mythication (title added) also from and in draft adjusted
[12-17-09]
[12-19-09]
[12-21-09]
[12-22-09]
[12-23-09 also a link added]
[12-31-09: links at particular order added at *
[1-2-10: Dow and Dylan and bold added to particular order and asterisks flipped.]
[1-2-09(oops OH-TEN): Raw Story Ribble (P.S. undated square bracketed material will normally not be linked to updates if added same day as post. Curved brackets are more immediate asides (or edits).]
[1-5-10:
[1-6-10: Also a Sixth Sense.
[1-7-10: Can it. Or Book it...Rusho(Enough! I must find my post later [1-6-10 see down] but in regards to the Health Care in Hawaii and Colorado here are some updates.]
UPDATE(2) Con Text ADDED 12-15-09
Needs attention(4):go figure
Note Several items saved in draft
(there should be only one with this label)*
[blank, making the point?, updates]
Recent Index beyond (1-4)**
Hiatus of Thought (3)
[Under Construction]
12-16-09
* note asterisk moved from previous line and irony of example as saved in draft are not accessible but following line notes 3 of several (punderstanding of grammar and puctuation)
** index aka archive you search
Real Mythication (title added) also from and in draft adjusted
[12-17-09]
[12-19-09]
[12-21-09]
[12-22-09]
[12-23-09 also a link added]
[12-31-09: links at particular order added at *
[1-2-10: Dow and Dylan and bold added to particular order and asterisks flipped.]
[1-2-09(oops OH-TEN): Raw Story Ribble (P.S. undated square bracketed material will normally not be linked to updates if added same day as post. Curved brackets are more immediate asides (or edits).]
[1-5-10:
[1-6-10: Also a Sixth Sense.
[1-7-10: Can it. Or Book it...Rusho(Enough! I must find my post later [1-6-10 see down] but in regards to the Health Care in Hawaii and Colorado here are some updates.]
Monday, December 14, 2009
Saving the spot *
Hypatia
Joe Brewer
Cognitive Policy Works
What about the patriarchal trap**?
* AKA: under construction or on Sabbatical FNA: saved in draft
** sounds like?
[Also... go figure...]
Joe Brewer
Cognitive Policy Works
What about the patriarchal trap**?
* AKA: under construction or on Sabbatical FNA: saved in draft
** sounds like?
[Also... go figure...]
Friday, December 11, 2009
Noble, No Bell, Nobel
It was no dynomite for some, nor Hopenhagen.
[Comment above posting on 12-14-09..Originally held in draft 12-11-09 continue as AMENDED here:
Obama's Nobel Lecture; MSNBC, Part I, Part II, Part III, Part IV, Jon Stewart , If Only[**]. ]
[Rounding it out: Obama Doctrine*, If Only, Great Debates, Values: to boldly go wagering "hard work" ]
[EarlierWest PointSpeech: just in case]
* "If Only" this link were followed by...(ribble?)following the Obama Doctrine and wagering Peace. "If Only" duplicity hints at Asterisk Trek, or the star power of words. Do not confuse the just with the jest.
[For future and path, consideration.]
[See 1st comment: PEACE! Get 'er done! Not pieces, get err done. On the other hand...]
[** 12-15-09 UPDATE: Arianna Huffington aggrees with Sarah Palin? Only in Con Text which is out of context, meaning what opinion makers so easily do by selecting their snippets. Neither Palin nor Bush would have been able give this speech and put war in context, but taking it out of context, there could be no difference.]
[Comment above posting on 12-14-09..Originally held in draft 12-11-09 continue as AMENDED here:
Obama's Nobel Lecture; MSNBC, Part I, Part II, Part III, Part IV, Jon Stewart , If Only[**]. ]
[Rounding it out: Obama Doctrine*, If Only, Great Debates, Values: to boldly go wagering "hard work" ]
[EarlierWest PointSpeech: just in case]
* "If Only" this link were followed by...(ribble?)following the Obama Doctrine and wagering Peace. "If Only" duplicity hints at Asterisk Trek, or the star power of words. Do not confuse the just with the jest.
[For future and path, consideration.]
[See 1st comment: PEACE! Get 'er done! Not pieces, get err done. On the other hand...]
[** 12-15-09 UPDATE: Arianna Huffington aggrees with Sarah Palin? Only in Con Text which is out of context, meaning what opinion makers so easily do by selecting their snippets. Neither Palin nor Bush would have been able give this speech and put war in context, but taking it out of context, there could be no difference.]
Labels:
CNN,
Grist,
Huffington Post,
Jon Stewart,
MSNBC,
NYTimes,
Obama,
The Nation
Wednesday, December 09, 2009
Hiatus of Thought
I was going to use the word with the intent to replace "Sabbatical" and figure out if was maybe be going to "third times a charm"** but maybe it is the "exception that proves the rule". Seldom do I actually fully read a piece before keying a few strokes and I may hit the rough but never take Mulligans.* It may be a none too subtle lie, but the irony is in the wedge, that John Fund hit. True, Southern Democrats played their part in the 1964 Civil Rights Bill filibuster, and so are they playing it now. But...things change.
* I think I will keep that punderstanding in my golf bag or locker...Hint: Cheetah's Club.
footnote: Nixonland...drop...Goldwater.
** hiatus confirmed, typo corrected: charm not charge
* I think I will keep that punderstanding in my golf bag or locker...Hint: Cheetah's Club.
footnote: Nixonland...drop...Goldwater.
** hiatus confirmed, typo corrected: charm not charge
Friday, December 04, 2009
Rubric's Cube and Rhetorical Realmifications.
you google*
Caution...The Goose for the Gander.(6-13-12)
[Kant We All Get Along Without Going To Hegel?]
Credit Olbermann, Clemons and Dick Cheney, not to mention Charles Dickens; the tales aside. It seems that we are broaching the American Dream from the nightmare of history.
footnote: Hegel Can't
Not to mention, D'Cart before Newton.[***]
[*] e for go figure; i.e. oops, ironically coined a word - NOT - how's 'bout realmystication? (Perhaps Realmythication?) But the question is, by the goose or the gander? More disambiguated, google may have adjusted as it no longer pops up "ramifications", but it could be my lack of foundation between the geek and the street. You might ask, what about google? Maybe a ribble, search me.
[** 12:08 PST 12-6-09: OK, I am not going to rhyme or jiggle but should I be glad I've maybe been read or mad I my might have been borrowed. Now that I have read the body of the work, the pop quiz it concludes with is rhetorical or at least left open, but least it had 4 options plus all of above; while a Republican Survey misdirected to me, was a push poll of yes, no and no opinion, which does not have as much wiggle room as their questions.] Along these lines, giving the "locked in" a "what for", as in not exactly any contradictions there.]
[Also 12-6-09 note that I was trying to determine if there is such a thing as Rubric's Cube, it was not a mispell as my previous post did refer to Rubic's cube.]
[12-16-09 Update made "go figure"(also 12-14 Realmythication apparently coined.]
[*** 12-23-09 link inserted ]
1-9-14 Kant we all ... ? Roots / Branches / axe knot*? Is it not that some are so lost from their roots they cut off branches? No. Or create limbs that leap? Ask if there are more primary fields than four mats: Physics, Psychology, Philosoply, Politics? Aphorism or fact: Truth is a determinant. Math is next to godliness, and religion parting from Platonics. Speaking of fields they are more than planes, knot too categorical lee. (G'Ribble Label?)
Caution...The Goose for the Gander.(6-13-12)
[Kant We All Get Along Without Going To Hegel?]
It was the worst of times, it was the best of times. [**]
Steven Clemons: On Olbermann
Palin and the Pashtun and the Dickens it is.
Lawrence Wilkerson: on ibid. [6-22-12 Link Corrected]
A Christmas Carol meets A Wonderful Life.
Credit Olbermann, Clemons and Dick Cheney, not to mention Charles Dickens; the tales aside. It seems that we are broaching the American Dream from the nightmare of history.
footnote: Hegel Can't
Not to mention, D'Cart before Newton.[***]
[*] e for go figure; i.e. oops, ironically coined a word - NOT - how's 'bout realmystication? (Perhaps Realmythication?) But the question is, by the goose or the gander? More disambiguated, google may have adjusted as it no longer pops up "ramifications", but it could be my lack of foundation between the geek and the street. You might ask, what about google? Maybe a ribble, search me.
[** 12:08 PST 12-6-09: OK, I am not going to rhyme or jiggle but should I be glad I've maybe been read or mad I my might have been borrowed. Now that I have read the body of the work, the pop quiz it concludes with is rhetorical or at least left open, but least it had 4 options plus all of above; while a Republican Survey misdirected to me, was a push poll of yes, no and no opinion, which does not have as much wiggle room as their questions.] Along these lines, giving the "locked in" a "what for", as in not exactly any contradictions there.]
[Also 12-6-09 note that I was trying to determine if there is such a thing as Rubric's Cube, it was not a mispell as my previous post did refer to Rubic's cube.]
[12-16-09 Update made "go figure"(also 12-14 Realmythication apparently coined.]
[*** 12-23-09 link inserted ]
1-9-14 Kant we all ... ? Roots / Branches / axe knot*? Is it not that some are so lost from their roots they cut off branches? No. Or create limbs that leap? Ask if there are more primary fields than four mats: Physics, Psychology, Philosoply, Politics? Aphorism or fact: Truth is a determinant. Math is next to godliness, and religion parting from Platonics. Speaking of fields they are more than planes, knot too categorical lee. (G'Ribble Label?)
Wednesday, December 02, 2009
Value Posted.
Pro Log:
Who let the dogs out!
Not exactly three part harmony *** on Capitol Hill.
[* reference to an email including ]
[**] {Index of priority links: "Speech", "no vapid" (General Eaton), Pakistan, Maddow (1:15-1:52)}
[Last reference: Center for American Progress ]
[*** actual lyrics are in a different Three Dog Night song, speaking of the Radio, I must find the second hour of the Norman Goldman Show to get Ray McGovern's take on things.]
*** Rubic's Cube in this piece(smashed or missing), but Rubric's Cube in this realm mythication.
I must preface, that I caught a lot of the reaction along with snippets of the speech on MSNBC(which was no bed of roses) before I finally listened to the whole speech while writing (interspersed) the second[*] blog post. Somewhere embedded is the video of Mathews with Ron Reagan Jr. where he is bating Karen Finney. So if you run into it, let me know, but I have an index of priority links, the first being the speech[**], which I think is the most important in history. Yet. OK, maybe not so melodramatically but solemnly considered to be in the balance. Meaning: if these pragmatic and incremental tactics are not strategically implemented, there will be a much harder and dangerous, Rube Goldberg, if not broken with a peace busted, Rubic's Cube. Any opposition must address all the concerns of our puzzle, not that some pressure will not be welcomed to tweak the navigator and the crew.](the preceding was actual preface in an email)
Who let the dogs out!
Not exactly three part harmony *** on Capitol Hill.
[* reference to an email including ]
[**] {Index of priority links: "Speech", "no vapid" (General Eaton), Pakistan, Maddow (1:15-1:52)}
[Last reference: Center for American Progress ]
[*** actual lyrics are in a different Three Dog Night song, speaking of the Radio, I must find the second hour of the Norman Goldman Show to get Ray McGovern's take on things.]
*** Rubic's Cube in this piece(smashed or missing), but Rubric's Cube in this realm mythication.
Value Added?
Chris Matthews is Value Taxed.
Mid-Speech (13:35 in video):
It is not so much was is said, but what is not[***] said or heard elsewhere.[**] Number one threat to national security now? Economic Crisis Second or was number one before the last administration: Nuclear Proliferation.
I don't know if I can find the point where a Republican critic complains that we can't address some of the concerns at home, how can we address them in Afghanistan? That is a great point. It should have been considered before we shifted from getting Bin Laden and to regime change in Iraq. But the important difference is that Afghanistan needs to build their governmental processes amidst turmoil, while we have got one already in turmoil thanks to the Chicken Hawks*, and Afghanistan does not have the stumbling blocks which are our foundations and which the previous administration and current Republicans continue to trample.
* I think we can safely say Chris Matthews is one now, but I don't really know he did not serve. The only wiki connection is other MSNBC military analysts. Not to mention Rube Goldberg. He did serve: "in the United States Peace Corps in Swaziland from 1968 to 1970 as a trade development advisor."
[**] added link
[***] similarly Pakistan has a government that must be dealt with with all our influence. (27:03) Values Sir CHARGE![Sometimes I can't believe Matthews was ever in politics or heard any of the Bush speechs- but that is maybe good for an interviewer, because we must listen to his guests.]
[Having now finished hearing the speech, after spending too much time on the reactions, I must say that the speech was a solemn thrill and no vapid rhetoric. I think I detected that in the faces and response from "the Corps" and one would not expect them to act like groupies at a rock concert or talk show hosts.
[And 1:15 to 1:52 with Rachel Maddow. Lastly I have sorted the bold links{see below index} and I hope you have "found my thrill". Maybe we should have a thrill added tax, but there "he goes" again.]
{Index of priority links: "Speech", "no vapid" (General Eaton), Pakistan, Maddow (1:15-1:52)}
Mid-Speech (13:35 in video):
[quote]To meet that goal, we will pursue the following objectives within Afghanistan. We must deny al Qaeda a safe-haven. We must reverse the Taliban's momentum and deny it the ability to overthrow the government. And we must strengthen the capacity of Afghanistan's Security Forces and government, so that they can take lead responsibility for Afghanistan's future
It is not so much was is said, but what is not[***] said or heard elsewhere.[**] Number one threat to national security now? Economic Crisis Second or was number one before the last administration: Nuclear Proliferation.
I don't know if I can find the point where a Republican critic complains that we can't address some of the concerns at home, how can we address them in Afghanistan? That is a great point. It should have been considered before we shifted from getting Bin Laden and to regime change in Iraq. But the important difference is that Afghanistan needs to build their governmental processes amidst turmoil, while we have got one already in turmoil thanks to the Chicken Hawks*, and Afghanistan does not have the stumbling blocks which are our foundations and which the previous administration and current Republicans continue to trample.
* I think we can safely say Chris Matthews is one now, but I don't really know he did not serve. The only wiki connection is other MSNBC military analysts. Not to mention Rube Goldberg. He did serve: "in the United States Peace Corps in Swaziland from 1968 to 1970 as a trade development advisor."
[**] added link
[***] similarly Pakistan has a government that must be dealt with with all our influence. (27:03) Values Sir CHARGE![Sometimes I can't believe Matthews was ever in politics or heard any of the Bush speechs- but that is maybe good for an interviewer, because we must listen to his guests.]
[Having now finished hearing the speech, after spending too much time on the reactions, I must say that the speech was a solemn thrill and no vapid rhetoric. I think I detected that in the faces and response from "the Corps" and one would not expect them to act like groupies at a rock concert or talk show hosts.
[And 1:15 to 1:52 with Rachel Maddow. Lastly I have sorted the bold links{see below index} and I hope you have "found my thrill". Maybe we should have a thrill added tax, but there "he goes" again.]
{Index of priority links: "Speech", "no vapid" (General Eaton), Pakistan, Maddow (1:15-1:52)}
Tuesday, December 01, 2009
Preemptive Comment
Only slightly: Pardon Cheney, he doesn't know what the "legal definition" of anything is. Pardon me, Chris Matthews, we need a new word for "beyond hypothetical". He asked a guest what they would be saying if Bush has just given the same speech. Since Ron Reagan was one the guests, it might have made sense if the other guest had been a Republican but maybe not. My point? This is not a speech that Bush could have given or ever would have given, no matter how similar one thinks it sounds. At least not on Cheney's watch.[**]
Speech - TEXT
CNN video
Biden support
Republicans agree. (OK this is a tangent, but I earlier thought that Cheney is getting too much coverage. If his comments would be filtered to what was really news and reasonably accurate, he would get none.)
MSNBC - General Eaton - Steve Clemons - Cenk Uygur * - Howard Fineman - Hardball - Rachel Maddow - also - Olbermann - Maxine Waters - Kucinich - Ed Schultz - Pragmatic
* I am in Karen Finney's corner
[**] 12-1-09 update: which gives short shrift to Bush's natural proclivities.
Speech - TEXT
CNN video
Biden support
Republicans agree. (OK this is a tangent, but I earlier thought that Cheney is getting too much coverage. If his comments would be filtered to what was really news and reasonably accurate, he would get none.)
MSNBC - General Eaton - Steve Clemons - Cenk Uygur * - Howard Fineman - Hardball - Rachel Maddow - also - Olbermann - Maxine Waters - Kucinich - Ed Schultz - Pragmatic
* I am in Karen Finney's corner
[**] 12-1-09 update: which gives short shrift to Bush's natural proclivities.
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